Years ago, Social Security judges regularly asked claimants about unemployment applications at hearings, but I rarely hear these questions anymore.  I advise my clients that if a judge does ask if they have filed for unemployment, an appropriate answer would be to state that he/she would like to work and would be willing to try any type of job even though his/her medical or mental health condition is likely to create performance or attendance issues.

Further, I tell my clients that, in my opinion, one or more “unsuccessful job attempts” serves as compelling evidence that one is motivated to work but simply does not have the capacity to do so.  Interestingly it has been my experience that an unsuccessful work attempt of 3 months or less can help your case, whereas a work attempt over 3 months can create problems – take a look at my YouTube video about work attempts and trial work periods for more about this topic.

Recently, this issue of unemployment applications came up – this time in an unfavorable decision I received in a case I tried before a judge who is normally more likely than average to approve claims.  My client in this case had some significant mental health and physical medical issues but he came across as arrogant and lazy to the judge who clearly did not want to give him any benefit of the doubt.

One of the issues that the judge discussed in this case was the unemployment issue – here’s how the judge addressed it in the decision:

Pursuant to a November 15, 2006 memo from then Chief Administrative Law Judge Frank A. Cristaudo, “receipt of unemployment benefits does not preclude the receipt of Social Security disability benefits.”  Judge Cristaudo further discusses the issue:

…application for unemployment benefits is evidence that the ALJ must consider together with all of the medical and other evidence…For instance, the fact that a person has, during his or her alleged period of disability, sought employment at jobs with physical demands in excess of the person’s alleged limitations would be a relevant factor that an ALJ should take into account, particularly if the ALJ inquired about an explanation for this apparent inconsistency.

Accordingly, ALJs should look at the totality of the circumstances in determining the significance of the application for unemployment benefits and related efforts to obtain employment…

In this case, my client did not have a good explanation for why he was unable to remain employed.   Not only were his post-application work attempts at jobs with significant physical demands but he testified that he quit those jobs because they were “dead end jobs” and “boring.”  At no point did he testify that he quit because the physical or mental requirements of those jobs was beyond his capacity.

Here are the conclusions that I am taking from this decision and other experience:

• if you file for unemployment benefits while you are also filing for Social Security disability, you should be prepared to explain yourself (this is where you would discuss your desire to try to work despite your issues)
• if your record shows work attempts at jobs which have physical requirements in excess of the limited physical capacity you are claiming for Social Security purposes, these work attempts could be used against you
• if you try to work and quit, you should focus on problems you had performing the tasks of your job or with reliability, not because you were bored or not making enough money
• work attempts after applying for benefits can function as helpful evidence but if you work too long (i.e., more than 3 months) or if your reasons for leaving are not directly related to your alleged impairment, those work attempts will be used against you.

–Sue

Jonathan Ginsberg responds: Sue, thanks for your question.  It sounds like you have been through quite a bit.  I believe that Social Security will consider your homeopathic treatment as "non-standard."  As such, an administrative law judge may assign the homeopathic osteopath’s reports less value.

Social Security has extensive rules about how judges are supposed to evaulate evidence – how much weight should the judge give a particular medical report.  For example, the reports and conclusions of a treating physician are to be given more weight than the conclusions of a doctor that you saw one time.  This is why, by the way, that I encourage my clients with no insurance and limited financial resources to see a doctor regularly, even if "regularly" means once a year.  That on-going relationship can help move that doctor into the category of "regular treating physician."

Non-standard practitioners are given very little weight by Social Security.  Chiropratctors, for example, are considered non-standard medical providers.  That is not to say that your chiropractor’s records will not be read and considered part of your record.  However, a judge will not base his decision on the records and conclusions of a chiropractor.

You will face the same issues with a homeopathic practitioner.  If there are records in your file from an accepted source (like a medical doctor), those records will be accepted over the conclusions of your osteopath.  Furthermore, you may find that some judges are outright hostile towards homeopathy and they could find that you are being non-compliant with recommended treatment.

My purpose here is not to rail against homeopathy or chiropractic.  I just want you to understand that at this point Social Security does recognize the legitimacy of these types of treatment and that you could jeopardize your case if you base it on this type of non-traditional care.  So, if possible, maintain your contact with and treatment by more traditional health care providers.

What happens in the case of depression, where there are no tests? I have been in therapy for 10 years and taking antidepressant medication, but my
symptoms are pretty much all still self-reported.
–Deborah

Jonathan Ginsberg responds:  Deborah, thank you for your throughful question.  Firstly, please recognize that there are tests that can be used to evaluate depression.  Psychologists regularly use these tests to evaluate the symptoms, the severity and the legitimacy of a depression complaint.

Along these lines, you will need support from one or more treating physicians, psychologists or therapists to help you win a disability case.  Impairments in Social Security cases must be "medically determinable" and SSA expects to see on-going treatment and reports from a treating source that are consistent with your complaints.

In the case of a mental health complaint, SSA will usually send you out for a consultative psychological exam, but I would want more than one consultative exam if I was representing a claimant suffering with depression.

[tags] depression and social security, mental health disability [/tags]

Jonathan Ginsberg responds: Angie, thanks for your email and I’m sorry to hear about your husband’s issues. Based on what you write, I think that he has a good chance at getting approved for benefits. Here are a couple of thoughts….

First, you need to find out if he is “insured” for Title II disability. As a rule, he needs to have 20 covered quarters out of the last 40 quarters. As there are 4 quarters in a year, that means he needs to have worked for 5 out of the last 10 years. The way the system works if he has earned around $3,000 in a calendar year, he gets credit for 4 quarters. You can find out if he has enough quarters for Title II disability by filling out a form 7004. It is important to know if he is covered because if he is not, he would only be eligible for SSI. And SSI can be offset by your earnings, assets and other factors.

Assuming he is covered, he needs to apply. That’s easy and free – call 800-772-1213. The next step is to build a winning case. Although he can hire a lawyer at any step in the process, in most cases there is not much a lawyer can do until SSA denies his claim. Some folks even wait until the second denial (reconsideration) before hiring a lawyer. I have written a book about winning at the initial and recon levels – see www.disabilityforms.com. My book and course explain how to fill out the forms using the terms and approach most attractive to Social Security.

My book is designed to help people at the initial and recon stages – if you have to request a hearing, I’d say you are better off with a lawyer. My disability lawyer referral link is here. If you hire a lawyer at this late date, your lawyer may (or may not) want to ask for a continuance to make sure that the file is updated.
The way you win is to find a treating doctor who will support your argument that your husband would not be a reliable worker because of unscheduled absences caused by any physical or mental health limitations. The technical term for this is “residual functional capacity.” In other words, what capacity for work remains after you take into account the limitations caused by his medical problems?

One word of caution – I have found that Social Security tends to see things in black and white. Part time work that generates income can confuse the issue – SSA often concludes that if you can work Job XYZ part time then you could probably work a less demanding Job ABC full time.

And finally, I think that your husband may be better off focusing on one of his conditions as the primary reason he cannot work. I have found that SSA is more receptive to a clear theory of disability based on one major problem than disability based on numerous problems.

–Jonathan